Traveller-digest            Monday, 22 July 1996        Volume 1996 : Number 278

(R)1996. Traveller is a registered trademark of FarFuture Enterprises.
All rights reserved.

The following topics are covered in this digest:

         1. re: Alternate literary sources for Traveller
         2. Re: More Canadian horn-blowing
         3. TNE Wrap-up, Sales
         4. Fighters and acceleration
         5. Regency and the Virus
         6. Re: [T96#268] E-Zine Name
         7. GenCon
         8. re: Urban legends
         9. Re: Fighters and acceleration
        10. Re: Psionic auto-mindprobe? (Td V96#271)
        11. Re: Traveller-digest V1996 #277
        12. Re: Realism (Td V96 #273)
        13. Fast Fighter Fanatatics 
        14. Re: Fighters and acceleration
        15. Re: Psionic auto-mindprobe?
        16. Re: Fighters and acceleration

----------------------------------------------------------------------

From: "Christopher Weuve" <caw@intercon.com>
Date: Sun, 21 Jul 1996 14:58:13 -0400
Subject: re: Alternate literary sources for Traveller

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About a week ago, John Snead mentioned the works of George R.R. Martin, Elucki 
Bes Shahar, and Joan Vinge as being excellent alternate literary sources for 
Traveller. Bill White mentioned Jack McDevitt's _A Talent for War_ as being an 
excellent source as well.  [I can't comment on the first three, as I have not 
read the books in question, but _A Talent for War_ would make an excellent 
Traveller adventure.]

I would like to add the _Exordium_ series by Dave Trowbridge and Sherwood 
Smith.  These are some of the most Traveller-like books I have read. 

The author's webpage (http://www.well.com/user/davetrow/) contain the 
following back-cover blurbs:

The Phoenix in Flight 
(ISBN 0-812-52024-6)   
Humans have colonized a thousand worlds, and empires have risen and fallen. 
Now the Phoenix House rules the Thousand Suns from their planet Arthelion. And 
now the Panarch Gelasaar has won the mortal enmity of Eusabian, Lord of 
Vengeance, Avatar of Dol, the ruler of Dol'jhar. 

In one swift instant that has taken more than twenty years to plan, Eusabian 
will strike, slaying Gelasaar's sons and taking the Panarch himself captive. 
And then Eusabian will sit on the Emerald Throne, and Dol'har will rule the 
Panarchy of the Thousand Suns. 

But Brandon nyr-Arkad, the Panarch's scapegrace son, has chosen this moment to 
defy protocol and evade a ceremonial duty. And so he escapes the death 
prepared for him, and lives. Now the hope of the Thousand Suns rests in the 
sensual, surprisingly capable hands of an aristocratic fugitive with an agenda 
all his own. 


Ruler of Naught 
(ISBN 0-812-52025-4)  
Jerrode Eusabian, Avatar of Dol, sits uneasy on the Emerald Throne of the 
Thousand Suns, while Brandon vlith-Arkad, rightful heir to the throne, is 
harried across space. 

Brandon was meant to die, along with his two older brothers. But he escaped by 
merest chance--now he is the only hope for the restoration of the Phoenix 
House and the salvation of the people they once ruled. Brandon and his allies, 
the crew of the Rifter ship _Telvarna_, must flee from peril to peril in 
search of the one haven no Rifter would ever willingly seek: Ares Station, 
heart of the Panarchy's military power. 

And across the unthinkable reaches of space, the scattered Fleet of the 
Thousand Suns is slowly learning that their Panarch has been taken, and their 
home worlds sacked. 


A Prison Unsought 
(ISBN 0-812-52026-2)  
Brandon vlith-Arkad is safe on Ares, the Panarchic Navy's HQ. The sole heir to 
the Emerald Throne must now fight a battle of symbols and deadly political 
intent, if he is to win the power to order the Navy into battle, to rescue his 
father, and win back the Panarchy now usurped by Eusabian of Dol'jhar. 

With him in this prison of velvet ropes and poisoned gifts is the crew of the 
_Telvarna_, the Rifter pirates whose loyalty Brandon has won in battle. 

Meanwhile, Brandon's father, the Panarch of the Thousand Suns, is being 
transported to the prison planet Gehenna. On board the ship he is fighting his 
own subtle war with his former fosterling, Eusabian's son, Anaris. If Gelasaar 
can discover any hint that Anaris can rule as an Arkad would, the captive 
Panarch will aid Anaris to overthrow Eusabian himself. 


The Rifter's Covenant 
(ISBN 0-812-52027-0)  
>From Pirate to Emperor... 

Young Brandon Arkad has been brought by war and disaster to a duty he never 
expected: Panarch of the Thousand Suns, Emperor of the human worlds beyond the 
Rift. But his Empire is in shambles, as the implacable Jerrode Eusabian and 
his Rifter allies continue to pillage whole planets, and the Emerald Throne 
is out of reach on occupied Arthelion. 

The surviving nobility of the Panarchy have gathered aboard  Ares , the 
headquarters of the Panarchic Fleet. Now Brandon must grasp the power given 
him in the moment of his father's death, and wield it to wrest his 
empire from the hands of the usurper. But he must win the faith of his people 
before he can hope to win a war, and that will not be easy. 

For there is a traitor at the heart of the Panarchy, thwarting Brandon's every 
move with poisonous rumor and murderous plots--a traitor at the center of 
Brandon's councils, close enough to be invisible--a traitor who will stop at 
nothing to destroy the Arkad dynasty. 


The Thrones of Kronos 
(December 1996)  


Trowbridge says that he would "like to think of it as a sort of weird hybrid 
of the _Lensman_ series and _Dangerous Liaisons_."

Sorry of this sounds like a commercial, but it is one of the best series I 
have ever read, so when I get the chance to advertise it I jump.

Christopher Weuve  [caw@intercon.com]
Through sheer random chance, my employer may 
someday agree with something I say.

- --part_AE17F604000FD8DF00000002--


------------------------------

From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)
Date: Sun, 21 Jul 1996 21:28:30 PST
Subject: Re: More Canadian horn-blowing

In mail you write:

> Tom Opgenorth wrote:
>>         The first radio transmission was made in Canada, can't remeber 
>>         by who

The first *long range* transmision was made in Canada. And it was
Marconi who did it. He'd done a fair amount of short range stuff
elsewhere.

BTW, at the time it *wasn't* Canada, it was Newfoundland. :-)

- -- 
Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)
 shadow@krypton.rain.com        <--preferred
leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com     <--last resort

------------------------------

From: David Jaques-Watson <davidjw@pcug.org.au>
Date: Mon, 22 Jul 1996 23:08:45 +1000 (EST)
Subject: TNE Wrap-up, Sales

Dear Folks -

1. TNE WRAP-UP

If it is any consolation for Dave, I thought that his remark was just an 
off-hand comment and certainly not an attack on IG. I hope that no-one 
there took it as such.

I also want to extend my best wishes to him in his efforts to wrap up 
the Regency/Coalition storyline - especially the future of the Regency as 
he sees it.

2. SALES FIGURES


Something I should point out as I remember it: my question to Don was 
"why did you *initially* select Bk2 and HG as the starship rules?". This 
is when he gave me the figures. Now, from what I've been able to guess, IG 
felt that this was probably the most controversial area of the game. They 
ran the idea of Bk2/HG "up the flagpole" to see who would shoot at it.

This approach has allowed all of us to have an input into the form that the 
"new" rules are taking - either directly, such as Dave Golden & Wildstar's
work, or via the responses to Marc's survey (Don has a copy), or just via our 
comments/criticisms/supportive words.

- - Hyphen
(David Jaques-Watson)
"I file things in historical order, with a hashing algorithm of gravity".



------------------------------

From: Glenn Crawford <marz@hotstar.net>
Date: Mon, 22 Jul 1996 09:26:41 +0000
Subject: Fighters and acceleration

> why use fighters...

I always wondered why the 6G limit?
Modern jets can routinely pull up to 10 or more.
The only reaso I can think of is that maybe there was a dep't of 
health study and they decided that not only were all fighters to be 
non-smoking, there were not to pull more than compensated G's

------------------------------

From: lewis@chara.gsu.edu
Date: Mon, 22 Jul 96 09:36:02 -0400
Subject: Regency and the Virus

>You've probably already been 'zinged' for this, but:  It was the RC, not 
>the Regency, that adopted 'domesticated' (Peacemaker) virus strains for 
>their own shipboard computer systems, as detailed in the "Vampire Fleets" 
>sourcebook.  That same resource also, quite unmistakably, points out the 
>Regency opposition to such an action.  Check out the quote about "pacts 
>with devils" if you've got it.

Actually the Regency uses them also.  If you read the Referee's Section
on Avery, it talks about using domesticated specialy bred virus
strains. Also the Department in charge of fighting the Virus keeps some
strains of Virus on hand.  
I think that the upper levels of the government keep Virus strains,
knowing how useful it could be, while telling the people that Virus is
evil and must be destroyed.    The Regency puts on this great act of
having changed from the old bad days of the Imperium, but still does
alot of the same stuff.  In the RSB, there is a paragraph on how useful
lies are, ie Norris promoting himself etc.

Lewis

------------------------------

From: Joe Walsh <ransom@connect.iconnect.net>
Date: Mon, 22 Jul 1996 08:39:55 -0500 (CDT)
Subject: Re: [T96#268] E-Zine Name

On Sun, 21 Jul 1996, P. ENGEBOS wrote:

> On Sun, 21 Jul 1996, Joe Walsh wrote:
> 
> > >  ::>Weapons: "Lock 'n Load"
> Lock and Load is the name of the equipment book for Optimus Design 
> Studio's Battlelords of the 23th Century Game...

Wouldn't you know it.  "All the good ones are taken." :(


- -Joe
______________________________________________________________________________
Joseph E. Walsh      |  Atari 8-Bit User and Programmer Since 1982
ransom@iconnect.net  |  Classic Traveller Referee Since 1983
Stuck in the '80s    |  Microsoft-Free and Loving It! :)



------------------------------

From: Vanya <dmoody@bridge.com>
Date: Mon, 22 Jul 1996 07:47:45 -0500
Subject: GenCon

I got my pass into GenCon a couple days ago, and my confirmation of a spot in the Traveller 
Strategic Battles for Friday, 8am.  Is anyone else going to GenCon?  Anyone playing TSB?  Is 
their anything I need to know/bring? 

- -- 
 _____
|* * *|	-Vanya
|  ^  |	 "Conquering Russia is a
 \/ \/	steppe by steppe process."
  \ /

------------------------------

From: ross@odyssee.net (Ross Coburn)
Date: Mon, 22 Jul 1996 10:15:55 -0500
Subject: re: Urban legends

Well, if you all want to compare poorly-designed buildings, take my
(former) school, Vanier College in Montreal.

Built in a cnoverted nunnery, the so-called New Building (imaginative,
what) is located between a pair of cemeteries and over buried chemical
waste.  When I first heard about this, I figured it for a legend.  Being of
an occasionally journalistic bent however, I did a little digging.  The
school's Director of Facilities confirmed that it was true but asked me not
to mention anything, as every couple of years the story resurfaces and
makes the administration miserable.

Of course, I promised not to say a word.  Even managed to do it with a
straight face...




------------------------------

From: Liam_McCauley@qsp.co.uk (Liam McCauley)
Date: Mon, 22 Jul 1996 16:32:02 +0200
Subject: Re: Fighters and acceleration

     Remember that a Traveller space combat turn is of the order of half an 
     hour.  Pulling 10G for this length of time would be quite a strain (to 
     put it mildly) using present technology.  Of course, with 6G 
     compensation...
     
     Does anyone have any accurate data on the number of G's a pilot (i.e. 
     selected & trained for high-g ops) in reclined seat wearing a g-suit, 
     etc. can maintain for a couple of hours at a time without penalty (and 
     also the max g's that a pilot can still just keep conscious)?
     Personal, anecdotal experience says that I (unfit & untrained) was 
     able to maintain between 2-3 G's (IIRC) in a glider (very reclined 
     seat - almost horizontal) whilst circling in thermals for about 45 
     minutes before I got dizzy.  I guess military pilots would be able to 
     manage 4-5 G's for a considerable length of time without ill effect.
     
     Which is why I think a 10G fighter is possible in Traveller.
     
     Cheers,
     Liam

______________________________ Reply Separator _________________________________
Subject: Fighters and acceleration
Author:  Glenn Crawford <marz@hotstar.net> at internet
Date:    22/07/96 10:26


> why use fighters...
     
I always wondered why the 6G limit?
Modern jets can routinely pull up to 10 or more.
The only reaso I can think of is that maybe there was a dep't of 
health study and they decided that not only were all fighters to be 
non-smoking, there were not to pull more than compensated G's

------------------------------

From: Derek Wildstar <wildstar@qrc.com>
Date: Mon, 22 Jul 96 10:43:30 -0400
Subject: Re: Psionic auto-mindprobe? (Td V96#271)

Mark Seemann <mark@dk-online.dk> wrote:
> One of my players have a psionic character with telepathy, awareness and =
> telekinesis. The character is considering mindprobing herself to see =
> what happens.
> 
> Any ideas?

Lots!  This is a wonderful campaign opportunity!  <evil grin>

While I've heard a few people saying that this can't be done, or that you
shouldn't allow it, IMHO that's a bad attitude for a referee to take.  If at
all possible, the referee should encourage the players to do all sorts of
things - even things that you didn't think of.  It's the mark of a poor
referee to rule them impossible just because it requires thought or
preparation that he hasn't done (on the other hand, it's perfectly within
the referee's rights to end the session early so that he can catch up with
the players).

YOu can do a lot with this, and even more if the character's player is
co-operative.  For example, here are some possibilities:

> Will everything unconscious be revealed for her?

Maybe.  If you (preferably with the co-operation of the player in question)
can come up with a suitable horrible episode from her childhood that has
been repressed ever since.  She can learn about it, and the next portion of
the campaign plot can revolve around resolving this - revenge, given the
nature of Traveller players, is a possiblity.

> Will she goes insane?

Maybe.  This one would require the close co-operation of the player - If she
goes insane, I certainly hope that her companions would try to help her.
The next few portions of the plot could revolve around locating a cure
(there must be one, but finding it may be difficult and dangerous - perhaps
only the Zhodani can help).  The character herself will have to be played as
in insane women - you and the player will have to work out just how crazy,
and how often.  It might be most interesting if there are moments when she's
almost normal, and moments when she's totally helpless (or worse!).

> Or will she aquire spiritual enlightenment?

Maybe.  I can't think of as many good angles on this one as on the others.
But it's possible, and if you want to take the campaign into spiritual and
religious matters, this would be a hook.  This can certainly be a rationale
for entirely re-thinking the character's personality: perhaps as a result of
her spirirtual awakening, she becomes a dedicated pacifist and/or
vegetarian.  Perhaps she feels a need to enlighten others, and she (and the
party) are persecuted for it - the only thing more despised than a false
phophet is a true one.

> Is it possible at all?

Sure, why not?

> Or is there a danger for an infinite recursive loop?
> A finite recursive loop?

Maybe.  Having the character go catatonic or into a coma wouldn't be very
interesting for her player.  This could be an excuse for skipping a few
sessions, though.  Bring it up as a possible risk, though - so that the
player can feel good for sucessfully avoiding _that_ risk.


wildstar@qrc.com
- ------------------------------------------------------------------------------
                                   "Dreams do not vanish, so long as people do
                                    not abandon them."  --- Phantom F. Harlock

------------------------------

From: Tom Opgenorth <topgenor@freenet.edmonton.ab.ca>
Date: Mon, 22 Jul 1996 08:43:01 -0600 (MDT)
Subject: Re: Traveller-digest V1996 #277

> >>In the 58th Century, Canada will be (mis)remembered as a country with two
> >>official languages -- English and French -- so at war with one another that
> >>the country needed a German national anthem:
> >>
> >>O Canada, O Canada
> >>Wie treu sind Deine Bl=E4tter!
> 
> 
> >        Maintenant, pour ceux d'entre nous qui ne parlons pas l'Allemand,
> > pourrais-tu nous traduire tout ca pour qu'on puisse decider s'il faut te
> > flamber ou non :)?
> Speak English ! There are no subtitles in this mailing list!!!

Well, I'm not a Franco-Canadian, just a poor Alberta boy who sometimes 
reads the French side of the cereal box in the morning.  I think what he 
is trying to say to the to fellow who combined O Tannenbaum with O Canada 
is something like: Sseeing as how people don't speak German on the list 
they shouldn't use German or they might get flamed??

Not to sure on this, so don't quote me.

===========================================================================
Tom Opgenorth                               topgenor@freenet.edmonton.ab.ca
Edmonton, Alberta,Canada                 http://www.worldgate.com/~topgenor
- ---------------------------------------------------------------------------
Manubay's Laws For Programmers:
  1.  If a programmer's modification of an existing program works, it's
      probably not what the users want.
  2.  User don't know what they really want, but they know for certain what 
      they don't want.
===========================================================================


------------------------------

From: Derek Wildstar <wildstar@qrc.com>
Date: Mon, 22 Jul 96 11:31:09 -0400
Subject: Re: Realism (Td V96 #273)

"Stuart L. Dollar" <sdollar@goodnet.com> wrote:
> Meanwhile, about 5-10 miles upstream, the Mill Avenue bridge, which 
> was like close to 100 years old...withstood everything that was 
> thrown at it...

Not _too_ far from here is a stone viaduct built by the Baltimore
and Ohio railroad company on their original main line west.  The viaduct was
built well over 150 years ago, and still carries the traffic on the
B&O's modern-day successor, CSX, despite the fact that trains are a _lot_
heavier now than they were when the bridge was designed.

wildstar@qrc.com
- ------------------------------------------------------------------------------
                                                                Vis sit tecum! 

------------------------------

From: Les Howie <lhowie@novalis.ca>
Date: Mon, 22 Jul 1996 12:28:14 -0300
Subject: Fast Fighter Fanatatics 

At 08:00 AM 7/22/96 -0400, Michael Barry wrote:
    
>     This would have your fighter leaving 
>     the carrier at maybe 500m/s faster than the carrier itself (somebody 
>     check my calculations, please!).

Let's just accept those numbers for now.  We'll set aside the issue of
compensation for the 30G (or whatever) push.  Lets take a simple scenario.
Carrier has no speed advantage over the target at T0 (worst case, but not
unreasonable if this tactic is going to be important).  Carrier launches 6G
fighters at 1 light-second (in BR terms, this is damn close - TL15 lasers
are all going to have this as effective range).  Enemy detects launch,
decides to evade, thrusts at 6G away from pursuers.  That means your only
speed advantage is your 500m/s.  At 500 m/s, it will take you 600,000
seconds to close the 300,000,000 m gap.

Time is really on your side with acceleration.  While velocity increases
linearly with time, distance covered goes up with t^2.

    
>     This initial speed plus the 6G acceleration of the fighter, plus 
>     (possibly) some kind of disposable high-acceleration strap-on booster, 
>     would have your fighters intercepting the target faster than the 
>     capital ship could.

Yes, and since fighters are more likely to be built with all the crew in
tanks, It should have about a 3-G advantage.

  
>     Note that I think 6G acceleration is pretty bloody poor for thousands 
>     of years of technological development. I would expect a TL 15 fighter 
>     to have ten times the acceleration of a TL 12 craft, and a hundred 
>     times that of a TL9 one. Say TL 9 = 2G, TL12 = 20G, TL15 = 200G. 

Pay your money, pick your future history.  I have my won theories as to
where the 6G figure came from.

The fighter advantage NOT really reflected in the rules is maneuverability
- -- the ability to do a 180 without subjecting the crew to excessive G
forces.  In a fighter, we can (SHOULD!) place the pilot at the centre of
rotation.  In a larger ship, some of the crew are going to be at
extremities, and subjected to a centrifugal force proportional to length of
the ship and (IIRC) the square of the angular velocity required to
accomplish the turn.  Dispite G-Compensation, this presents a definite upper
limit to the rate at which a large ship can turn, which can be virtually
ignored by fighters.
Les Howie
Senior Software Developer
NovaLIS Technologies
Halifax NS
lhowie@novalis.ca


------------------------------

From: Bri <bri@teleport.com>
Date: Mon, 22 Jul 1996 09:07:41 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: Re: Fighters and acceleration

On Mon, 22 Jul 1996, Glenn Crawford wrote:

> > why use fighters...
>
> I always wondered why the 6G limit?
> Modern jets can routinely pull up to 10 or more.
> The only reaso I can think of is that maybe there was a dep't of
> health study and they decided that not only were all fighters to be
> non-smoking, there were not to pull more than compensated G's
 Rember, with modern fighters your talking about a few SECONDS at _most_
at even 9gs.. With traveler ships, you must rember that each "it's just
3gs over" is a _half hour_ of being 3 gees over. Your heart would be gone
by then.

bri <bri@teleport.com>
The Law, in its majestic equality, forbids the rich, as well as the
poor, to sleep under the bridges, to beg in the streets, and to steal
bread.      -- Anatole France


------------------------------

From: "Peter  H. Brenton" <pete@cummings.uchicago.edu>
Date: Mon, 22 Jul 1996 11:50:28 -0500 (CDT)
Subject: Re: Psionic auto-mindprobe?

On Fri, 19 Jul 1996, Glenn M. Goffin wrote:

> >From: Mark Seemann <mark@dk-online.dk>
> 
> >One of my players have a psionic character with telepathy, awareness and =
> >telekinesis. The character is considering mindprobing herself to see =
> >what happens. She has the skill and the power to do so.
> >
> >My question is, though, what will actually happen if she does so?

[Glenn's intelligent racially relative comments snipped]

I think that a human psionic attempting self probing would encounter
exactly what she expected to see, literally.  If something is hidden from
her "normally" by her subconcious mind, using an ability of the same mind
would not remove the block.

I would think of it as trying to lift yourself by your own bootstraps.
You just can't find anyplace to stand :)  Or perhaps like using a mirror
to see the back of your head.  It's still the same head, just from another
perspective.

Now, certain circumstances might change this, could a multiple personality
schizophrenic perceive one of (or the) other personalities? (this has
interesting implications...) Perhaps mind
relaxing drugs or some other altered state would allow some deeper probing
(not self-hypnosis though, all your self-defenses are still in place under
self-hypnosis unless some way is found of fooling yourself).  I think that
in order to relax enough defenses to allow this kind of probing, the
person would be pretty much unable to *do* the probing.  Maybe a
self-destructive person could do things that a more stable personality
could not.

Just as we are always hearing our own voice with hearing, I would think
that a telepathic person would always be listening to their own thoughts
(albiet a bit distorted, just as our voices are via the vibration of our
skull to our own ears - that's why your own recorded voice sounds wierd),
and nothing unknown can be found via self-telepathy.

Just a little pop-psychology to brighten your day.

Pete


------------------------------

From: Tom Ellis <tellis@telerama.lm.com>
Date: Mon, 22 Jul 1996 13:13:15 -0400 (EDT)
Subject: Re: Fighters and acceleration

On Mon, 22 Jul 1996, Glenn Crawford wrote:

> > why use fighters...
> 
> I always wondered why the 6G limit?
> Modern jets can routinely pull up to 10 or more.
> The only reaso I can think of is that maybe there was a dep't of 
> health study and they decided that not only were all fighters to be 
> non-smoking, there were not to pull more than compensated G's
> 




Cute, but you cannot compare the occasional 9 or 10 G's pulled by an air
pilot to 6G of *constant* accelleration.  And again, I do believe (no
books here) that the limit was 6G before inertial dampers failed to help.


_______________________________________________________
Tom Ellis
tellis@telerama.lm.com
http://www.lm.com/~tellis/

"No! Do, or do not.  There is not try." Yoda
_______________________________________________________ 


------------------------------

End of Traveller-digest V1996 #278
**********************************
